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[GENERAL] The Sakurazaka46 / Keyakizaka46 Thread

Discussion in 'General Sakurazaka46 Discussion' started by ForrestFuller, Jun 28, 2015.

  1. JoltFiend

    JoltFiend Future Girls Stage48 Donor

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    I'm not so attached to the group that I'm all doom and gloom about the name change/reboot/whatever's going to happen in October that I've been seeing here. I'm just going to keep supporting the group as I can, however it turns out in the end.

    Katakana Keyaki :hehe:
     
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  2. Dill

    Dill Next Girls

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    Techi
    I don't really understand the reason mngmnt would change our Overture, it makes no sense to me.
    I don't like to think we may not have our other songs performed anymore, but somehow it's more understandable since this is the way they chosen, but Overture? Would really be so necessary?

    I too think Fukyouwaon is lost. It requires too much from performers, which is one of the reasons other groups may cover it, but it wouldn't have the same impact (only SKE performed it with a similar intensity once) and it's probably the song more linked to Techi for good and bad. Considering mngmnt chose to run away instead of believing in the current members I don't think they'll put it in a future set list if not a modified version, in like 15 years, when former keyaki still in the entertainment may perform it.

    Kuroi Hitsuji is the other song I think we lost forever. It's not the song we love more as fans, but for me is the perfect song in term of music, lyrics, performance, intensity. I often wondered how Keyaki could top it and the answer may be they couldn't have.
    We'll never know, perhaps that is the creative limit we could reach and surely it's already way out of usual idol music standard.

    Even if we aren't considering them right now, we already lost Yuichans songs since awhile and all the solos we had. Techi's had always performed only her last one and Neru and Zuumin solos have not be performed once if I'm not wrong. Correct me if I'm forgetting some perfomance. If I'm not, we already said goodbye to a part of our discography but it had been a more diluted progression than this, so it felt more natural.

    Last opinion, I think Hono's Fukyouwaon has been the best version so far.
     
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  3. Philosophy Senpai

    Philosophy Senpai Next Girls

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    Well, let me add a few more things on the discussion, always from my humble point-of-view. Some of these thoughts I have never expressed so far (for the sake of discussion, I would follow the lines of @DelicateEmpress and assume the name Toriizaka46 for the group):

    Regarding Fukyouwaon: It's NOT in my favorite list... If they decide to exclude it form the repertoire of Toriizaka46 I won't miss it. If we are ever "allowed" to select the most "vulgar" song I would vote for Fukyouwaon hands down. It's strong, yes, but also extremely stamina-consuming with fierce choreo, but... choreo-wise we've seen better: we've seen strong and crisp movements that create the effect of "drawing in 3d with female bodies", we've seen elegance through austerity, richness and expression in movements (Hiraishin maybe?). I also find it a little too verbalistic.

    Will it annoy me if it's excluded? Yes, definitely as I consider it a song of Keyakizaka46 AND Toriizaka46 repertoire. It's THEIR song. Now, regarding "Boku wa yada!" I agree with @Dill: Hono's is BY FAR the best! So at least this argument is no excuse for excluding the song: They tried Hono for this pinnacle of the song, she did GREAT, so we have our "Boku wa yada!" it's as simple as that...!

    Regarding Silent Majority: Again NOT in my favorite list... But seriously, how will these girls, under the Toriizaka46 name (or whatever) are EVER going to appear to their fans without performing their ANTHEM. And I repeat: if anyone has the potential right to try to perform it, so does Toriizaka46 (they have all the rights in this world actually!). For me, excluding this song will be once and for all unacceptable and, irrevocably inexcusable!

    The same more or less apply to Kuroi Hitsuji but there is a big BUT here: I adore this song and consider it unique among all their repertoire. For me, Kuroi is the "statistical outlier" in an already huge dispersion and variability of styles, content and execution within the Keyaki huge repertoire. It is unique on almost everything, belongs to a category of its own, opened-up a new path for songs (proper or not to follow is totally another huge topic of discussion - in my opinion not) and pushed the group into a completely dark and ominous mood. I also consider THIS SONG (made - intentionally?) to be the one with the most prominent link to Hirate and her aura. So if I had to choose a song to handle down to Tecchi as "her song" among the Keyaki repertoire, that would be Kuroi. All these are therefore more than enough to justify its exclusion from Toriizaka46 repertoire, however these reasons are still not enough to make ME feel happy about this exclusion.

    Finally some thoughts about the Yui-chanzu repertoire after @Dill mentioning it and after the coincidence of me happening to re-watch yesterday the Karaoke Party after the end of Keyabingo 2: Shibuyagawa was performed by Zuumin and Fuu. It was a very decent performance within Karaoke standards. The group has some good vocalists that would support Pon (that would be Fuyuka, Nijika, Marina and Inori to name a few - with Morirena dictated by my hunch feeling). These are songs that also belong to the repertoire of Keyakizaka/Toriizaka so performing them would also provide a best context to try a rotation of good vocalists within the group, providing an element of surprise and adding to the variety and interest in the dynamics between members, increasing the overall value of the group and make many fans much much happier in the process!
     
  4. Jsprite

    Jsprite Future Girls

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    It seems that besides Techi's Boku wa yada! (the best, whether you love or hate the girl), it was given to the most popular member after Techi at the time (Neru, -but even the members made fun of hers), and the 2nd gen pushed member (Hono). It also was given to Sugai, because I guess she was the Captain (hers was loud and surprised everyone). What was the overall impact to my ears? In this order: Techi, Yuuka, Hono, Neru. Just to be clear, I am talking only about the enunciation/explosiveness/overall-effect of those 3 magical words, not that member's entire performance, level of effort, etc.

    I get it that we want to be nice to the 2nd gen girls in general, and Hono is a nice, sweet girl. She was paired with Techi as she looked the most promising with the next gen center successor in mind. But Hono's Boku wa yada! was just GOOD to me.
     
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  5. Dill

    Dill Next Girls

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    I don't get it. "We want to be nice to 2nd gen in general?" Where it came from?
    Everyone has their own opinions and if you consider your own valid why other's should be lead by a feeling of kindness instead of recognition towards the effort Hono made?

    @Philosophy Senpai I don't remember that particular duet, I'll have to refresh my memory re-watching KeyaBingo soon.
    I agree with your opinion but I'm also aware mngmnt's choice so far had been not let other members sing duets or solo song when the original performer graduated. Why they chose this policy I have no idea, but it was like that since Zuumin grad. I can't help but think they will never put those songs in the set list of whatever Keyaki will become like they never put in Keyaki setlist post graduation.
    (I may be the only one who is sad to lose Pon/Habu duet lol)

    We'll have new duets and new solos probably, but Techi's solos would have a weight attached and Zuumin's... as singer she always had been on another level and we still don't have anyone with her training in Keyaki, even if we have nice voices and good singers.
     
  6. Jsprite

    Jsprite Future Girls

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    I kindly suggest you read my comment again. I made a point to exclude effort from it. I'm sure Hono and all other members put their best effort forward, nobody's questioning that. Let's not mix apples and oranges.
     
  7. Philosophy Senpai

    Philosophy Senpai Next Girls

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    Tecchi's Boku was always calculated, its loudness controlled and (most frequently at least) not overflowing of emotions. Neru was just cute and possibly given a "Boku" as she was a prominent member. Hono's was tragical (in the ancient Greek tragedy way), full of emotions and desperation. A similar Boku was offered to us also by Tecchi but only in her final Kouhaku and TD. If we ever see Hono repeating such a Boku, I believe that she may be the legitimate carrier of this particular torch...
    Now... Kyonko??? Well, I would pay a lit to hear a Boku from her voice, but this will never happen, so we'll never know...

    P.S. (@Dill and @Jsprite It always nice to see kind ways of resolving any tiny misunderstandings between two of my fondest frequents in this forum)...
     
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  8. turbogig

    turbogig Member

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    Keyakizaka 46 LIVE at Tokyo Dome BD sold 112 000 copies and placed 7th among all BDs sold in 2020. Overall, we lost to the likes of Johnny's and Frozen 2, but managed to beat BTS. Source
     
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  9. keyak

    keyak Upcoming Girls

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    Awesomesauce. I think combined DVD/Blu-Ray copies sold for Live at Tokyo Dome were at about ~99k last time I checked in April so that's a pretty good increase over the last few months, esp in this current economy. This probably brings them close to ~140k in total sales, making it Keyaki's most sold concert release yet (not that impressive tho, considering there's only been 2 other releases aka Republics 2017 & 2018 - give us more concert DVDs S&F :wall:)

    I'd be real happy if Tokyo Dome sales can make it to top 5 in Oricon's yearly music chart but I don't think we can defeat all those Johnny's boys and their crazed teenage female wota fandom power :rolleyes:

    --

    And since, you guys were talking about Boku wa yada earlier - one vote for Sugai and Hono each. Techi - no need to vote, hers was best hands on. (sorry Neru)

    I would pay an arm and leg to see (hear) this..

    I personally would like to see one certain 2nd gen girl inherit Techi's solos but in fear of others further labeling her "Techi 2.0", I won't say her name :^^;:
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
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  10. rdamon42

    rdamon42 Member

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    Careful, you start saying things like that and others will get jealous haha. I do agree though, its nice to see differences in opinion resolved respectfully.

    I saw this on twitter so I don't take credit for the idea: how about a last performance from the original 21 (including Neru, excluding Harada Mayu) as a proper farewell to Keyakizaka46? Not gonna happen, but its nice to dream. I would not be opposed to a special song too.

    Perhaps when the new Keyaki is reborn and releases strong, consistent singles and both Techi and Neru evolve as solo artists, we can hope for a collaboration in the future. What I hope to see is that the group will be on par and the same level as those two, so there will be less of the "those girls are just background dancers" chatter (which I hate so much personally)

    Well then..

    S&F Presents one time only, Saito Kyoko centering Fukyouwaon, performed for the first time ever!

    Sorry, I'll stop now. :XD:
     
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  11. Maeda_Toshiie

    Maeda_Toshiie Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2020
    Oh indeed, fear female wota power. For all the male wota shit (mixing, tigering, mad love shouting, jumping) and stacks of CDs, the female wotas (usually those chasing male idols) make it up by the insane amount of money they pump into their obessions.

    Fans of Johnny are particularly renown in that respect.

    10Q
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
  12. DelicateEmpress

    DelicateEmpress Upcoming Girls

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    hirateyurina
    All Techi and Neru solos have been performed at least once, Zuumin performed her first solo song before but I'm not quite sure about the 2 other ones. I assume she at least performed her grad song during the grad event. Personally, I'd prefer to have the graduation songs mostly or entirely untouched (Kado Wo Magaru, Hitei Shita Mirai, Hi ga Noboru Made) since not only they're very personal to their original singer, they also contain the message of leaving so I think fans would be very worried if a member suddenly performs these songs in a concert setting.

    Who do you think will be the first 2ki or next 1ki to get a solo since t's a pretty good indicator for push? After reading this interview, I think a Marina and Inori duo is more possible than any 2ki solo right now. For 1ki it'd definitely be Pon.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
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  13. keyak

    keyak Upcoming Girls

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    Guess we'll need to work harder to get some recognition here. [hehe]

    As a female wota, I unfortunately fall in the former category rather than the latter.. Can't afford to buy shit but will eagerly enter the boxing ring to showcase my loud love for my Sakamichi girls (and fight tooth and nail against those who interfere).

    :hehe:

    Now I would love to see Rinachanzu but Hono & Morita could really benefit from a push right now. Cause those two already have the complete recipe for idol success (talent + beauty + charisma). They just need exposure.

    I do think Matsuda will/is getting a push. From her front-row position in the long-gone 9th senbatsu to her selection as Keyaki's rep for the recent Disney medley perf, she's easily gearing up to become a frontrunner come Sakurazaka in October.

    1ki - no idea if any of them will get a push but hey, better late than never! My vote is on Dare ga's holy quartet (Sugai, Akanen, Risa, Pon).

    edit;; sorry - you were talking solo, not push in the general sense. Hmm, Matsuda will probably be the first for 2ki & def Pon for 1ki. A Heel no Takasa Part 2 (aka Yuukanen duet) would be wonderful though.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2020
  14. Jsprite

    Jsprite Future Girls

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    A solo would be given to a member that may be popular, but who can also hold a tune, otherwise it'd be embarrassing, it doesn't matter how popular the girl is. So far, for 2nd gen, Matsuda has a surprisingly good voice. Can't really tell the rest of 2nd gen, much less the new 2nd gen. I guess PonPon for 1st gen.
     
  15. rdamon42

    rdamon42 Member

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    You know who I was surprised by when it came to singing voice?

    Inoue Rina. Goodness gracious, that girl can sing. I really loved that when she and Matsuda blended voices for the Futari Sezon acapella. Everybody is talking about Ten-chan, Hono and RunRun (rightfully so, I love those three) but I feel like we are underappreciating InoRi as a talent. Her crinkled cuteness and smiling eyes plus a newfound confidence in variety are a plus as well.

    Matsuda did do the Disney singing medley, no? Must see that. I saw she performed with Kubo-chan and Miipan, hope she did well.

    I'm not really super familiar who among the 1ki are the strongest singers, I do know that Zuumin was a strong vocalist back in the day. Haven't heard PonPon enough to make a judgment.
     
  16. Dill

    Dill Next Girls

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    Sorry, I'll phrase it better, my english is not always linear: Why your opinion of Yuuka is good while ours about Hono is driven by our decision to be kind towards 2ki?
    Just curious, you never espressed this kind of thought before and it surprised me

    Btw guys and girls, I don't know what you are talking about. We are ALWYAS super respectfull and extremely diplomatic around here! [hehe]

    Inori, right? :D

    Pon is probably the best shot we currently have for solo songs, but I hope they keep her for duets. She has the kind of voice that blend well with others. As for 2ki... I haven't heard enough to really decide, even though Marina and Inori gave interesting performance but it would be good also consider new 2ki for it, IF we got some surprising gem of course.

    I think the DareGa 4 are the ones that less need to be pushed right now, so my completely unuseful vote would go to Fuuchan, Nijika, Uemura, Ozeki... I'm keeping Shiichan out because I have no idea what she'll do after October but she's another one I'd like to see shine.

    Do you think once the name change generations will be maintained though?

    I realized my baby TakeYui name didn't came up for a push but I strongly believe in her and who know? Mngmnt may surprise me, for once.
     
  17. Philosophy Senpai

    Philosophy Senpai Next Girls

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    Talking about Inori and Marina, check this:
    if the video does not show watch the video here
    What exactly is this? I stumbled upon it yesterday.
    Inoue and Matsuda have proved they have good voices with the a capella Futari. And of course in case we are blessed with another duet, we will support them! I said that before (but with my personal complex way of thinking) so I will say it again more plainly: if they are changing they better start making wild experiments! We need to see variety in everything and discover anything and everything each girl has potential to give.
    After all management's job is to discover and tap this potential isn't it?

    @keyak and @rdamon42 LOL you guys, made me blush! It was my mistake to start this and so it's me who should close it :blush: Of course you and a few others are also both in this amazing little group of people who, are posting everyday developing ideas and arguments in a civilized way about the group we love, connecting me with them every day, and giving me this strange feeling of an ethereal link between us all.

    P.S. @keyak If you ever get into a boxing ring to fight tooth and nail for the sake of Sakamichi just give us the word: we'll be there to cheerlead for you;)
     
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  18. Dill

    Dill Next Girls

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    That's the medley @rdamon42 was talking about. Marina performed it with Kubo from Nogi and Mirei from Hinata among other.. people lol
    Kubo replaced Ikuchan who should have been there so I'd like to take the chance to applaud her. It wasn't surely an easy task.
     
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  19. Jsprite

    Jsprite Future Girls

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    Inori has nice vocals too. Solo songs are usually tailored/matched to the personality of the singer, specially in the 48/46G world. I'd say Inoue for bright, happy songs, and Matsuda for the more serious ones, as she projects more of an otona vibe.
     
  20. Iamyoung

    Iamyoung Future Girls

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    Oct 16, 2018
    Well, judging by the acapella, Nijika and Fuuchan can sing. Koike has the voice too. The rest do have average singing voices though. Now imo, in all 1ki, I will say Pon is the best vocalist. She did show some of it in SR & mobame. She can sing in different types of voices and is able to switch the voice to blend in well with the others, unlike the rest who seems to have just one type of singing voice. RunRun too does have a nice singing voice.

    Listening to Dare Kane, both live and recorded, I think their singing has improved. I just hope mgmt explore that part of MatsuRina and use it fully. With more training, the girl can be really good.
     

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