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TV / Radio HKT48 vs. NGT48 Sashikita Gassen / HKT48 x NGT48 Tabeshoujo (2016/01/11 - 2016/03/28)

Discussion in 'HKT48 News & Releases' started by Togasaki, Jan 5, 2016.

  1. SoothingEarthDragon

    SoothingEarthDragon Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2015
    Oshimen:
    murashigeanna
    A lot of the interactions don't seem particularly scripted. There are far too many awkward, weird and candid interactions that I don't think a person would put into a script, nevermind how they clearly cut out large chunks of what was recorded every episode which there would be no need for if everyone was just reading lines.
    Some of the things are clearly scripted (such as introducing the segments) and those always come across very different from the general interactions.

    You really think writers wrote for Moeka after losing for her team at critical moments at least twice would break down crying and ask HKT48 to give them half the food? Or Noe complaining that she would never get to eat 1000 yen strawberries....

    Do you think Murashige's really weird interactions with Imamura during the segment Imamura was supposed to hold the tray steady while everyone put cups on it or Imamura crying and saying it was Murashige's fault for yelling in a loud, scary way was something someone wrote ahead of time?

    Or when Miku and Nako wrote down how many times other members got angry at them, both of them wrote 100 times while everyone else wrote a number less than 5 was something that was predetermined and they just happened to bring up Miku wrote that down but only if you watched the episode closely and likely pause it would you see that Nako wrote the same thing? That is implying the writers wrote a joke and utterly failed to deliver it when they apparently control every word that comes out of anyone's mouth according to you.

    You think the writers decided Sakura should utterly fail to find the swords, steal the swords the other girl was hitting her with (both of them) or her getting admonished for it?

    Certainly in the original case of Noe saying that she looked like Mio, it was almost certainly something that came up and it was decided that Sashihara should bring it up during the show, but I am pretty sure everything past that point was generally candid. Granted, they might be exaggerating things and maybe Mio was told to deny it.

    And I really don't see how the outcome of a lot of those games could possibly have been scripted unless they just took take after take until the right person won.

    Just because there is a script doesn't mean every single word everyone utters was predetermined. It is likely very much a rough outline with only the general topics and certain sections being fully written.

    I mean, on a very basic level, if everything for the show was being fully scripted then the personalities of the individual girls would shift wildly from variety show to variety show as they would be put in the hands of different writers who likely don't watch the other shows and that really doesn't happen. Writers generally cannot keep characters consistent within the same ongoing narrative on certain TV shows and (comic) book series and such, how are very different writers on very different shows going to be writing the idol's personalities consistent if you are so damn sure every single word is being pre-written and memorized? It just wouldn't happen.

    For example, you wouldn't see Murashige saying "ureshige!" and "kanashige!" on Hyakkaten, Goboten, Odekake, AKBingo and SashiKita Gassen if the different writers for each show had prewritten every word with only the vaguest notions of who HKT48 members even are.
     
  2. lazy

    lazy Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2014
    Location:
    North Earth
    Oshimen:
    kojimamako
    Scripted doesn't necessarily mean that absolutely everything is planned. I think Mecha mecha iketeru is a type of show that is very heavily scripted, and it is absolutely hilarious. Then you have shows that script the general plan of that show and whatever happens will happen (like AkBingo). Some of the talking points specifically tend to be scripted, but generally they film for a lot more than what you actually see on tv, so what makes it to the final cut can vary. I've made my peace with it. Reactions are always real and variety wise I think each member does what they expect suits Japanese variety.
     
  3. Togasaki

    Togasaki Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Oshimen:
    shimazakiharuka
    Mio's dislike for getting compared to Yamada Noe was defintely real and palpable.

    There are some people who use 'the script' as a blanket excuse for anything they would like to explain away, while anything they like are 'real emotions' it's just one of these things on this forum.
     
  4. kanjo

    kanjo Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

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    Aug 20, 2012
    Location:
    Ireland->Shimane
    Oshimen:
    Nishino Nanase
    Didn't Bingo recently accidentally air a prompt poster instructing the members to "riot wildly"?
     
  5. Togasaki

    Togasaki Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Oshimen:
    shimazakiharuka
    If that's true then it seems like AKB needs to be prompted even for the most basic things lol

    Yui was complaining recently how AKB was too quiet during AKBINGO shoots.
     
  6. Doodleboy

    Doodleboy Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2015
    Location:
    New York City, New York
    Oshimen:
    kashiwagiyuki
    One of the gradated members mentioned how she hated that she couldn't even smile on camera unless she was told to on AKBINGO. I forgot who it was but it was 3 months ago. They'd probably cut out all of her scenes if she couldn't hold in her smile.
     
  7. Togasaki

    Togasaki Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Oshimen:
    shimazakiharuka
    Yeah now it's getting absurd. The more absurder it gets the less sources are needed I guess.
     
  8. Doodleboy

    Doodleboy Member

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    May 29, 2015
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    New York City, New York
    Oshimen:
    kashiwagiyuki
  9. fatrain

    fatrain Under Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2014
    not that recently, but yeah...

    link to captures and following discussion ↓
    http://stage48.net/forum/index.php?threads/akbingo-08-10-01.1198/page-401#post-1117793

    those cue cards with directions/instructions are used all the time on all shows, not just because AKB is bad at variety or anything, that's how the shows are directed.
    for example, famous female talent Wakatsuki Chinatsu were telling how she was instructed to snap at big wig with that card on Sashihara Kaiwaizu #17

    9:24-
    http://48videodouga.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-3662.html

    of course, it doesn't mean that everything is scripted, but yeah, they have show's script where the outline of the show is written (what themes/ games there will be, etc.), they have meetings before the show, when they discuss what and how they'll roughly perform based on script and of course they have cue cards, which directors use to give instructions when recording.
    overall, Japanese variety has it's routines and predefined patterns and roles (characters, boke/tsukkomi, teaser/teased person), so a lot of reactions and actions are expected even without them being scripted or told. Sasshi teases Noe for her funny face and voice, so when Mio is told that she resembles Noe, she is expected to deny it and be unhappy about it. that's a comedy set and there is just no way Mio could do the opposite, that would be super unfunny. the same goes for Sakura. with her clumsy/nonathletic character she is expected to be super clumsy now. even if she actually can run properly if she tries. but that'll just ruin the comedy.
    so yeah, don't take everything that is shown in variety seriously, it's a show after all.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Togasaki

    Togasaki Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Oshimen:
    shimazakiharuka
    Of course cue cards are used for every variety show that's not a particularly new revelation, but if you need a cue card for every basic emotion, then that might be micromanaging things a little, no?

    Just as that bright light on 2ch said 'So the girls are so dumb that they have to use this kind of cue card?'

    I mean they can't be that dumb lol

    The point being that a cue card isn't necessary for everything unless you are a control freak of some kind or underestimate their intelligence or their variety skills which may or may not exist for some AKB members.

    Yes there are and that's why you wouldn't need a cue card for everything.

    In the case of Sakura, what you are referring to is a character, an act that is neither expected nor out of the girls' control. That's the usual blaming higher authority fallacy. What is indeed expected is something that the director can use, anything. What ever that is though, is up to the members, unless you have those cue cards. Those cue cards can't define an entire character though.

    In the case of Mio, she didn't want to be associated with Noe's 'character' and thats what has put her off. Mio apparently thinks she has an image to uphold and apparently she thinks it doesn't go together with Noe's image or character or what ever.

    The idea though that everything is limited to cue cards (which can only be very general directions anyway) or characters is a very convenient view, as it explains away anything that might be embarassing or otherwise have a negative impact. If you hold that view though, then all the expressions of positive emotions should be viewed under the same lens.

    Generally, I am much more suspicious of positive emotions or stories than of negative emotions or negative stories that come out. While most people I usually argue with hold the exact opposite view, always defending positivity, never acknowledging negativity, but they probably only act that way for the sake of their argument or because their bias towards certain girls leads them to think that way lol
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2016
  11. Doodleboy

    Doodleboy Member

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    May 29, 2015
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    New York City, New York
    Oshimen:
    kashiwagiyuki
    If I could remember which member it was then I'd search their social media and link it obviously. I don't have it right now. I'll search. Also, you said,"Yeah now it's getting absurd. The more absurder it gets the less sources are needed I guess." when the person before me also didn't provide a source.

    When I find the link, I'll edit my post to show you. (Not like what I'm saying is any different from what everyone else has stated).
     
  12. Togasaki

    Togasaki Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Oshimen:
    shimazakiharuka
    ^thanks.
     
  13. nobodywil

    nobodywil Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Location:
    From the Islands to The Bay
    So... are we still on that subject of "realty TV" still being "real" again? [hehe]

    I guess just like Pro Wrestlers, Idols are still "real" to people in front of a camera. Not fake, of course not. Personally, I could care less... but it's always fun for people throwing "opinions" as "facts" here at Stage48.


    IMHO. Of course. :awesome:
     
  14. EinhanderX

    EinhanderX Next Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    Amen to that. Let's hope by the time Sasshi graduate, they stay the same way.
    (this post was intended to divert the old talk here anyway lol)
     
  15. nobodywil

    nobodywil Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2009
    Location:
    From the Islands to The Bay
    ^I approve this post. Thanks. :approve:


    I hope she stays on the show even after graduating. She's an asset to both group with her variety chops to learn from.

    (If my opinion holds any weight around here :^^;:)
     
  16. EinhanderX

    EinhanderX Next Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    ^
    She will. No worries about that.:lol:
    (lol, We're all anon here. Since when anon opinion holds weight?:awesome: jk. You have wide-perspective there, I respect that):flower:
     
  17. fatrain

    fatrain Under Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2014
    @Togasaki

    sorry I lost you there in that wall of text. I think you misunderstood my comment.
    I'll try to summarize my thoughts more concisely.
    1) I didn't reply to anyone in particular, just tried to clarify some misunderstandings about variety in general with a couple of examples.
    2) the paragraphs about cue cards and variety routines in my first post are two separate thoughts. you kind of got fixated on cue cards and base all your replies on them, even though it's just one way to control the show and it was mentioned as such. I've never said that director control everything with cue cards alone and members act based on them alone.
    3) Mio and Sakura are textbook examples of variety routines, not cue cards. they just fulfill their variety roles, so it was kind of weird for me to read that someone actually accepts their actions at its face-value, got offended by it and whatnot -_-;
     
  18. Togasaki

    Togasaki Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Oshimen:
    shimazakiharuka
    ^I don't really get what it is that you are confused about, but whatever it is that you understood, I didn't say any of the things you said above. :confused:

    As for variety routines, while Sasshi is a textbook example of a permanent variety routine, Sakura and Mio are not. I think Sakura and to a lesser extend Mio are textbook examples of orthodox idols, or an attempt at it, because they (sometimes) fail at it, either because of a lack of actual skill such as singing talent or because someone calls them out (that's rare though). A mundane example would be how Sakura actually never liked Melonpan but pretended to so she can be in the Melonpan alliance.

    What I do believe though, is that you view the HKT girls through the lens of a Sasshi oshi, or rather, because Sasshi does it this way, the others are doing the same at all times, that is playing along with what ever Sasshi does. While that is probably true for a good chunk of HKT, it just isn't everything.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 8, 2016
  19. fatrain

    fatrain Under Girls

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2014
    what Mio and Sakura being orthodox idols (whatever that means)) and Sakura not liking melonpan have to do with anything?

    and no, Sasshi has nothing to do with it as well. the girls could be AKB members in AKBINGO and I would still say the same, variety rules apply to anyone))
     
  20. Cristafari

    Cristafari Stage48 Admin Staff Member Stage48 Admin

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2008
    Location:
    Saitama, Japan
    Oshimen:
    Iwasa Misaki
    Twitter:
    Cristafari
    Is it just me, or do I remember this EXACT SAME ARGUMENT (with many of the same participants) taking place in another thread just a couple of weeks ago? Anyway, that's enough. Some of you really need to give it a rest.
     

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