Is 48G peaked and now on the downhill?

maybe miserable **** would be a better description.

Pretty much all of us have said AKB have declined from where they were in 2010-2013 but most are ok with that and don't feel like wallowing in misery like some.

No group can sustain the heights that AKB did for longer than a few years and even in decline AKB is still doing very well.

 

Unfortunately even now, in 2016... it seems we still can't. Sorry Rodney.

I would only judge popular/decline by the ¥¥¥. Call me when one of the 48G closes up shop and then we can talk about "the sky is falling".

 

In a world that everything is considered a FLOP, I guess AKB still have some strength, at least where they aim for (idol wota market). Of course, sales is not everything (one can say that it's only due to HS or to adding new sis groups/memebers or doing other gimmicks or the profit might be low), but numbers are numbers and AKB still sell pretty bloody well ....
So, I guess, it peaked few years ago and now it's just stable on their idol wota market!

 

It's gone downhill, albeit slowly. Right now only the wotas are keeping the ship afloat.
Demand for akb girls after mid 2013 has not been the same, I'm basing this on the number of CMs akb girls had from 2010-2013 compared to today.

 

I still disagree with that assessment. If that were true, how do you explain STU48 and the new sister groups in Thailand and Manila? AKB is adding new fans every day. It's true that you don't see the girls in as many commercials as you did during Maeda's days, but the songs are still great, the stages are still top-notch and the girls are as cute and adorable as ever. I think AKB will be around for years to come selling a million plus copies of their singles. My humble opinion only, of course.

 

Like i said "slowly" and wotas are keeping the ship afloat, the casuals are almost all gone. Low CM appearances means low demand from jap entertainment industry. Also while they're getting new fans they're also losing fans from the recent graduates. Thailand and manila are irrelevant as they're completely different markets, while STU is unique and has gathered interest, but IMO it won't have a big enough fanbase since it doesn't really represent any place like the other SG's do, which IMO is what split akb's fans.
They will still sell millions because of the wotas, bringing me back to what i said that wotas are keeping the ship afloat.

 

It's always the wotas that keeps the ship afloat, who else would there be? Gaijins? lmao

Got any counts or stats of CM appearances from this statement of yours? And how does it relate that only CM appearance measures the group's popularity in the entertainment industry as the main indicator of "low demand" :O

You basically said nothing in this statement XD

lol it represents the unity of the 5 prefectures along the Seto inland sea which imo gathers more local fan support as a whole.

 

Funny you say gaijins, aren't you the one who brought up mnl and bnk as a testament to the akb's popularity? "lmao"? You mocking yourself? lol
Anyway the wotas STILL keeps the ship afloat, back then casuals was part of that equation. And it's not like I said it has sunk, but it's going downhill slowly.

Once I get back to my desktop I'll post all the links for those CMs.
You seem to be putting words into my mouth, I never said CMs are the ONLY indicator, I also never said anything about popularity, I said low CM means low demand, popularity and demand are two completely different things.

Actually I did, akb has lost some fans and has also gained new ones. That's actually one part that can't be refuted, I never said how many fans were lost or gained.
It's also true that whenever a member graduates some fans leave the fandom as well.

It travels along those 5 areas. It doesn't represent the unity of those 5 areas. Point me where it shows that STU is unity of 5 prefectures and I'll give you this one.



*edit*
2012
http://www.tokyohive.com/article/2012/12/2012-cm-king-queen-revealed/
2015
http://aramajapan.com/featured/which-celebrities-had-the-most-cm-contracts-in-2015/53075/
Just these two for now, I'll add other years later.
In 2012, inside the top 10 were 8 akb members, and 10 inside the top 13.
In 2015 only sasshi is in the top 10.

 

Check again bro, I'm not user "richard durbano". And no you don't have to take this personally, I'm just discussing about your statements.

So the equation is: Wotas + casuals = popular | Wotas - casuals = unpopular ?

Casuals must weight a lot in this eh...I'm not disagreeing with your conclusion but your process of conclusion, in fact I agree with your conclusion but not like how you stated things.

It's ALWAYS about the WOTAS since when it wasn't?? duh

Take your time, no rush. I just want to see some stats and comparison. So maybe I can use it as reference in the future too.

Since you just mentioned CM as the only indicator here and neglecting other factors and you didn't even mentioned anything else in your follow up statement, so I had to point it out.

Yes, popularity and demand are two different things, but they are indeed in close relation with each other. High popularity is in proportion to high demand. Have you seen any group with low popularity but high demand or high popularity but low demand? Rare, but not entirely impossible.

Plus this thread is mostly asking about the popularity not demand.(I believe) So when you are saying "AKB is going downhill slowly", are you talking about demand or popularity? Please clarify for me.

It's better if you said if the rate of "fans lost" is higher than "fans gained" or vice versa (Whichever you think is applicable). When you say you lost something then gained something back is basically telling me it has no context to evaluate.

Nor does your statement of "splitting akb's fans" have any evidence as well. It's just my opinion indifferent to your opinion and we will find out when STU actually works.

 

Whoops my bad haha. I was sure it was you lol. This is why i hate being on mobile haha.
Anyway I'm not taking it personal, I'm just having fun, a little teasing is ok as long as no one goes over the line.

Again I never said anything about popularity, but wotas - casuals = LESS popular, which is what I've been trying to tell from the start, the ship hasn't sunk but is sinking slowly.

Check my earlier post, I edited it with links for 2012 and 2015, I'm planning to add more.

You're just pointing at extremes. There're things such as moderate popularity and moderate demand. Again they have gotten LESS popular, I didn't say UNpopular, when will that sink in?

The thread is about akb going downhill in general not popularity or demand, I made a point that AKB is going downhill slowly (which is the title of the thread) and I made that point using low demands for CMs as basis.

Actually there's no point in arguing this one anymore, this one has become mathematical, when it's probably just misunderstanding because of the words used lol.

Which is why I said IMO, which you also said which means this one's up in the air ☺
*edit*
Actually this one has a little weight to it.
For sure some akb fans from nagoya switched to ske when they were formed. Same case with nmb and hkt, not saying all of them but there're some for sure.

 

All good, let's continue.

Now this is a slightly better assessment.

Coolio, I see it now. But what I'm asking is how does "low demand of CM for akb girls" has relation to "AKB going downhill"? Please clarify.

No, I'm just stating the relationship between popularity and demand.

You said "AKB is going downhill, slowly" which I think is too vague but it's aight if you explained it after, however you backed it up with "Wota's are the only ones that is keeping them floating" which is stating the obvious fact which only supports the "slow" rate of the sinking ship analogy part though. Finally you elaborated with the explanation because of "low demands of CM's for akb girls" which I think is too biased neglecting other factors. So I had to point it out.

But see now you are stating something a little bit more specific which I have no problem with now.

Yet you used "demand" in your argument/explanation...

If you can see the results of this thread, in the middle section, it uses popularity as the indicated variable of assessment. Soooooooo...if we read it again then it should be understood as "Is 48G peaked in (popularity) and now on the downhill?".

So when we say they are in the downhill, I will understand as their popularity is going downhill (which causes low demands of akb girls in CMs.)

Not the other other way around, where you are actually stating low demand of akb girls in CMs is an evidence that AKB is in the downhill.

Which you are trying to point out?

idk if you get this difference or not.

I'm not trying to argue the point or making it mathematical. I'm just saying your statement should be clear to what you are trying to express.

Your original statement if understood as equation we mentioned above then it would be: (...they're getting new fans they're also losing fans from the recent graduates.)

1(Some fans gained) + -1(Some fans lost) = 0 lol

And 0 states nothing has been said...

I said imo too right?

 

I voted 48G is going downhill but I meant that it isn't fresh anymore, that it's grown too much, that there are a lot of similar groups, that the music is moving away from what it used to be, that the main members are less charismatic now...in summary, that it's been losing its appeal more and more, at least for me...

 

Umm that's self explanatory, they're going downhill, low demand in cm is a reflection of that.

It's not vague. You're making it vague for yourself. Cristafari got it right away.

Again back then casuals were part of the equation now it's just wotas. Does everything have to be explained to you? Besides what's your problem with stating an obvious fact? Aren't we discussing stuff here based on facts?

It's not biased, you just jumped to the conclusion that I neglected other factors just because I didn't put anything else aside from the cms.

Huh? That's pretty much the same. It goes hand in hand, low cm demands is a reflection of them going downhill.

 

It's not lol What does it reflect? How much does it even reflect?

You didn't even explain it like Christarfari did. That's his interpretation and explanation which is legit in his own defense. Unless you are saying he speaks out everything exactly just as you are thinking inside your mind. lol

Then I got nothing to say.

Don't forget you had another chance to add to your explanation when someone else disagreed your assessment statement as well but you still went on with the CM evidence which you implied strongly that there is a direct relation where low CM demand for the group means they are going downhill. Yet you failed to explain why and how.

Because the first two facts doesn't have anything to do with your main evidence "akb girls dont get enough CMs".

In your reiteration of the second post you stated 3 things.
A. "AKB is going downhill, slowly"
B. "Wota's are the only ones that is keeping them floating"
C. "Low CM appearances means low demand from jap entertainment industry."

A + B are complimentary to each other and you had made that clear but you still haven't clearly explained how does C is even related to A + B. Saying it is self-explanatory is just vague and biased. Sorry but it just doesn't cut it.

No you don't have to, it's just you replied to my comments, and I got time to spare.

Problem here is you don't bring all the facts to the table. Can't even start discussing it because I don't know what you are trying to say due to the vagueness of such statements.

If you didn't input anything else other than reiterating the CM argument "twice" then probably people will think you have only that source of evidence right? So why can't you make things clear in the first place? hmm

If it's not vague or biased then you shouldn't be too bugged about for criticisms and clarifications. Hence this conversation.

Try again...ask yourself the following statements true or false.

One is problematic while another one is a fairer statement

a.) Their popularity is going downhill which causes low demands of akb girls in CMs. True or False?

b.) Low cm demands is a reflection of them going downhill. <<< Your words eh
True or False?

If you find one of the above options kind of iffy then it is probably not true, hence biased.

I will not explain further from here if you still don't get it...

And I repeat, AKB is definitely going down hill no doubt, but your reasoning to conclusion is very problematic.

 

What does it reflect? seriously?
read this again "They're going downhill, low demand in cm is a reflection of that." if you can't understand from that then I don't know what to tell you.
How much does it even reflect?
what? it's like asking how much did they grow this year lol.

Of course I didn't explain it like he did, we're different people, but he got it and you didn't. And of course it won't be everything exactly like what's in my mind but he got the gist of it and you didn't.

Here we go again, apparently you can't understand the phrase "They're going downhill, low demand in cm is a reflection of that" it's you who failed to understand that simple phrase.

They're still facts right? there's nothing wrong with them.
I'm stating facts, it doesn't have to be related to one another doesn't it?

Why does C have to be related to A and B? It doesn't need to be.
lazy? vague? no. Do you need an explanation for something like "This apple is rotten, those black marks are a reflection of that."?
And you're not using the word bias right. How can I be biased about it? What do I gain from favoring that side? lol.

It's not vague, and definitely not biased lol.
Who's bugged about criticisms? You're jumping to conclusions again.
I'm just bored, I'm not bugged.

So did you brought all the facts to the table right away from the very start of every conversation you've had here?
Also you do know that in court lawyers withhold some facts to be revealed later to help their case right? (not saying that that's what I was doing though) I'm just saying that not everything has to start with all the facts in the table.
"I don't know what you are trying to say due to the vagueness of such statements." It's not vague. It's just you can't understand it.

No, that's only you. It's crystal clear, you just can't understand it.

A. True
B. True
Didn't find anything iffy about that.

Again learn how to use the word "bias".

It's not my reasoning that's problematic, it's your comprehension that's problematic. You're just nitpicking on the words I use and also can't comprehend some simple phrases calling it "vague" when it's clear as day that it's not.

 

Aight, bruh. You win.

 

We're arguing on the net.
No one wins.