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TV / Radio Keyakitte, Kakenai? (2015/10/04 - )

Discussion in 'Keyakizaka46 News & Releases' started by rust, Sep 25, 2015.

  1. cotd

    cotd Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2019
    Oshimen:
    hirateyurina
    Rather than inviting a comedian again, I actually much prefer an episode focusing on Keyaki chan themselves. KeyaKake have invited a bunch of comedians just several episodes before, and now they are inviting a comedian who has openly complained about Keyaki variety? Past episodes such as how long did you believe in santa and relationship within members are simple but fun.
     
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  2. Xiphyas

    Xiphyas Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    May 22, 2017
    Location:
    Osaka, Japan
    Hi.

    Here are some factors behind Yoshimura Takashi-san invitation that probably international fans don't understand but I want to share.

    We know Keyakizaka46 as group is really strong and very well know, with a solid fanbase, good sells and great image. And with a successful Tokyo Dome concert.

    I can understand some complains from international fans, but there is some points you need to see.

    Osaka is behind Tokyo as market and economy and is the gate for all Kansai region wich can be stronger than Kantou region in some aspects.

    By popularity Nogizaka, Hinatazaka and NMB are more popular than Keyakizaka here. Many of fans I meet in HS here are from Tokyo and other regions.

    As I said before, Kansai region (especially Osaka) is hard for idols but is a great market once you entered, that's why many artists focused in Kansai at least once or more in their careers (Nagabuchi Tsuyoshi-san for example).

    In entertainment industry, what Kansai region sells more is comedy and variety shows. Comedians are respected, admired and can be a big influence.

    In Yoshimura-san (Heisei Nobushi Kobushi) case, he is very popular and the duo works a lot in Tokyo and they participate a lot in Downtown (comedy duo) shows. And now, Downtown are the strongest comedians in the country, Matsumoto Hitoshi-san is considered as comedy genius and their influence is enormous. So, joke or not, to say "Keyakizaka is bad in variety" in front of Downtown, doesn't help.

    I said in their space, that Koyabu-san was perfect for Hinatazaka. He helped Hinatazaka to gain more popularity in Osaka and was more notorious after being invited to Koyabu Sonic.

    Probably many international fans don't like comedians, but here, comedians are essential part in our culture and can help a lot, especially groups with young members.

    As Osakan I can say, the Kansai episode was risky but a great step to take. The second generation solo episode received a lot of good reviews in Osaka and I read many times "Kansai power".

    In my personal view, I think is good to have comedians as guests and especially someone popular as Yoshimura-san.

    But if you ask me Is really important? My answer will be definitely yes.

    And something probably you may find curious but the most popular member here was not from Kansai, was Neru-chan. And now the eyes are in second generation girls because as Hinatazaka second generation, they have all to power up the group.
     
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  3. risanen

    risanen Kenkyuusei

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    suzumotomiyu
    the same man who said to sashihara rino "you can use your body because you're goot at that" when she was making serious statements about yamaguchi maho's case. here is the article
    i really couldn't care less about what this unfunny old man and his friends think about keyaki's variety to be quite honest
     
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  4. Dill

    Dill Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2017
    Oshimen:
    Techi
    Twitter:
    Dill46_48
    What a great episode!
    I don't know how to not spoiler it because everyone knows by now what happened but it's the kind of episode that makes you feel the power Keyaki has on a stage and the answer from fans was incredible! Kudos to them all!
    The only thing I didn't like is the fact we get only 1 episode of Tokyo Dome, while it would be worth a mini serie all by itself lol

    Good job girls! They did great!

    @Xiphyas Personally I respect you and appreciate your posts a lot. Especially because there's always something to learn or to understand about a society and culture so different from my own.
    Rationally your post is an interesting explanation; and on a business level I'm sure it may help the girls to become more known and appreciated.... but I'm a fan, and being a fan means on some stuff you can't always be rational.
    If someone insult me I would never invite them in my home, I'd do my best to make them eat their words (in a non violent way, of course) and so I wish would do Keyakitte instead of making the girls beg for another chance.

    I'm not sure I'll watch the next two episodes (I'd probably do and then complaint about it lol) but there's people who already decided it's not worth their time. And I know we international fans are less important on this matter, but it's still hard to see the girls you love be humiliated.

    Comedians may be an important part of Japanese culture, but it doesn't make them less fallible than anyone else, and like @risanen said up here and like we had to witness with Naomi Osaka, they often go over a line they shouldn't cross. May be time for them to check themselves before talking about others.

    And now I'm gonna listen Keyaki discography like every after-concert-episode :banana:
     
  5. piduai

    piduai Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    May 16, 2019
  6. dragonfrommars

    dragonfrommars Kenkyuusei

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    Oshimen:
    wadamaaya
    i mean, is what he said really that insulting? don't we all realize this is the truth? i mean, it's not like he was lying or anything. the girls even say it themselves that their not good at variety, they've been saying it since the beginning so have guests & the MCs themselves.

    their's a clear difference between the variety skills of Keyakizaka (1st gens) and the variety skill of almost every other idol group out their. saying something that's true isn't the same as saying something thats bad imo.

    i mean, i have Uemura as my display pic, so obviously i like her... but i'm not going to lie to myself, she's horrible on that show, i could count on 1 hand the times she's said something funny in the entire 3 year history of the show.

    i personally think bringing comedians to show is a good idea... maybe they can learn how to be funny. with AKBINGO being cancelled & being skipped over for KEYABINGO, i honestly think they should work hard at getting better. having a variety show isn't a right, it's a privilege & there is no telling how long that privilege will last at this rate
     
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  7. Philosophy Senpai

    Philosophy Senpai Kenkyuusei

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    saitofuyuka
    Xiphyas thank you very much for adding insight to our understanding of the cultural background of the decision for the next Keyaki-tte Kakenai episode. It made me realize it would be important (or simply necessary) for the group. However, on a personal level I will watch it and possibly add it to the series of episodes that I have watched only once (the senbatsu episode 197 and the two following, 198 and 199) . And believe me I have watched all KK episodes between 5 to 15 times each (with less frequent being those with guests).

    For international fans episodes not focused on the group are at least tolerated (while some are somewhat interesting, like to quizz guy). However, I still do not understand inviting someone who has openly commented negatively on the group. As a person completely unaware of what has happened on that show when this person said that KYZ46 are bad at variety and as someone that knows little about the mentality I try to be careful and not exaggerate my words by saying that he "insulted" the group. Maybe not. My question is: could it be possible for the management of KYZ46 to penetrate the Kansai market by inviting other famous comedians, or by doing something else, instead of that?

    Anyway we'll have to have some faith and wait to see how this episode unfolds and what it may reveal. I hope that we will all be surprised positively.

    As for the Tokyo Dome episode 201...

    We need a documentary about it or at least a double episode! This appearance is a LANDMARK, it cannot pass just like this.

    This episode made me happy after seeing Fuu-chan and Run-chan my 1gen and 2gen oshis in a sequence one after the other shout to the audience and they both looked so happy. Especially Fuu's happiness healed my tortured heart for not making the senbatsu. She seems fine so I am not sad any more.

    My final comment deserves to go to Hono-chan: Her "boku wa yada" was really touching and overwhelmingly sentimental... This girl so far, was trying to show how much she loves and admires KYZ46 and how hard she desired to become part of it. This very second she proved to everyone that she was DESTINED to be part of this group!
     
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  8. Rev4

    Rev4 Kenkyuusei

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    Mar 22, 2019
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    watanaberisa
    Didn't Hono participated Hiragana audition in 2017 and forgot about third day audition or something like that. When Kanji was going to have an audition she applied for that group instead of Hiragana. Or basically AkiP and Konno saw she suited Kanji better because they were the ones who decided which group participants should be assigned to. Participants couldn't choose, this was Sakamichi Joint Auditions where anything could happen. If you wanted to enter Kanji Keyaki you were not guaranteed, you could be assigned to Nogi (Matsuo Miyu).

    Anyway, I was very surprised by Hono's performance and how much she said back in July that she has no confidence and is not currently good at dancing. But at Tokyo Dome she has improved so much. She has that Keyaki mental who can convey any song if it's soft, cool or experimental. Her vocals were so good that she could get a solo song in the future. When the centre rotation start to take place in the group she will be the first pick from mngmt.

    This brings questions if there are many Sakamichi trainee who want to enter this group could we get another sport festival episode to make the bonds even stronger in the group. I really enjoy those kind of episodes, both from Nogizakatte, doko? (Nogi's early days in 2013) and Keyakitte, kakenai? (2017 with Hiragana 1ki/2ki).

    @Xiphyas Very informative and good view on importance of variety. I think Keyaki have 6 members from Kansai now. There are two among Sakamichi trainee who are from Kansai as well. Masumoto Kira (Dorokatsu-chan) and Yumiki Nao (Fuufuu-chan). If they enter Keyaki that will be 8 members from Kansai and it could help Keyaki to grow in popularity in Kansai region as I think mngmt is targeting Kansai region to go nationwide for "Keyakitte, kakenai?" before they try other regions. It was a good step to invite Keisuke Okada, but like you said, they need to do more than that for mngmt to see Keyakitte is growing like Hina Ai and can make the move outside of Kanto when the day comes.
     
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  9. Xiphyas

    Xiphyas Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    May 22, 2017
    Location:
    Osaka, Japan
    Hi.

    Please don't misunderstand my comment. I have never said that comedians are perfect, they make mistakes very often but still, they may have the power to influence in the industry. And @risanen what happened with Matsumoto-san was a mistake especially when they were talking about Yamaguchi Maho-san case and for me, totally out of place.

    @Dill Thank you. Who knows me here, knows how much I love Keyakizaka and Hinatazaka and knows also that I'm a fan from the begining. I really want Keyakizaka to be bigger and to see all the girls shine and happy. But something that I have learned during all this time, is not to let the emotions be stronger than my reasoning, because otherwise, I could not be able to speak with aggressive "antis" or obsessive fans and believe me, I talk to many. Even as all you noticed, I have not written my review of the Tokyo Dome concert here, because I read comments that took away my motivation to do so. I apologize to those who waited for my post.

    What Yoshimura-san said about the group, is not considered an insult or offense, it is more an observation but using comedy. Many fans may find it offensive (especially non-Japanese) but they are not because worse things have been said in other programs (TV shows of different idols including AKB groups).



    It is difficult because idol groups need promotion through the media and the best and fastest way is to appear in variety shows. What Keyakizaka has in favor and gives them an advantage, is their current career and fame. But sometimes an idol group has to leave their comfort zone. And if the group agrees, management will make movements and taking risks for the benefit of the group.

    I need to remark something @dragonfrommars said well. A variety show is a privilege and something only a few idol groups can have. Deserved or not, liked or not, Keyakizaka needs to take care of their show. Bingo series has already ended and with that, the most important space AKB groups had. Another example is HKT48, they survived with HKT Variety but the group lose a lot if we think the group first years, now they have HKT Seishun taiiku-bu and fans are waiting for a second rebirth. The same with SKE48 and their variety shows. But the groups who have more promotion outside Tokyo are NMB48 and STU48, and they have solid variety shows.

    I always will wish the best for Keyakizaka and Hinatazaka because they deserve.

    Thanks for the space.

    =============================================

    @piduai I apologize but your question would lead to a fallacy if you use my answer to condition the validity of my comment.

    Yes, I am.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
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  10. Nakamuraada

    Nakamuraada Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2019
    allright after watched the preview i think it will be a funny episode, at least for me. I too agree that variety is really play a part in term of group popularity. So i hope keyakizaka will do a great job on their main tv show
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
  11. rizatom

    rizatom Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2019
    The episode hasn't aired yet but why already being so negative.
    Yesterday people may say something bad but who knows tomorrow they will say something good.

    Now Keyakizaka46 have new members with different personalities, maybe now they will see them differently.

    Something we need to realize the people who we called them losers are actually the girls', your idols/oshimens, senpais in their (Japan) entertainment industry whom they respect for. So rather than being negative, I prefer to sit back, relax and enjoy the show. See the outcomes of the attempts.
     
  12. Ophelia

    Ophelia Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2017
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    kitahararie
    Too much focus on guests and the second gen to me. Don't get me wrong, I love the new girls, but you can basically see gen 1 falling asleep in the back and me with them.
     
  13. Tenote

    Tenote Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2019
    Well so you like uemuu despite her not being good at variety, but couldn’t it apply to the group as a whole? Keyaki is not popular for their variety but for their music, and funny or not, we love the girls.

    I don’t mean to attack anyone, but I feel like people demand too much from these girls. You want them to deliver great performance AND be great in variety, basically you expect them to be perfect. What if you can’t have it both ways?

    @Xiphyas your posts are always insightful, thank you.

    A few days ago I saw a post about techi’s solo mv showing that most views were from Osaka. Perhaps they could succeed in Kansai area by promoting their music there more. Or what about a (comedy) drama set in Osaka?
    What I’m trying to say is that maybe variety shows might not be the only option to get more recognition.


    Regarding Tokyo dome, I can’t believe that we didn’t get a glimpse of techi dancing on the piano :( hono showed good expressions whenever caught on camera, I can see great potential in this girl.
    I hope the fukyouwaon curse has been lifted and it will be performed more from now on.
     
  14. Isaac H

    Isaac H Kenkyuusei Stage48 Donor

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    Feb 21, 2017
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    Malaysia
    You know...I've been trying to be really positive and upbeat about a lot of things, on this forum.

    Good God almighty. I mean, I never realized I could just be mad at something that will happen one week later.

    For the record, I believe Yoshimura had appear twice before: during Sawabe's birthday episode (#82, with his partner whose name escapes me at the moment, who also appeared again in another episode where Rika 'destroyed' him) and during Keyakake episode #134.

    1-ki's variety skills have been brought up ad infinitum & ad nauseam, so no use barking up that tree again. Think of the next episode as the follow up from Yoshimura's previous episode. He's there not as the focus, but to help out. Now 2-ki is the new batch with less experience, so it's natural to focus more on them as far as developments go. Maybe 1-ki can surprise him. Maybe he'll be nicer. If not, then unleash hell on him if you want to after the fact. After it happens, you know, one week from now.

    Sorry for my words, but come on...we only have so much energy everyday. And so much of life left. Why spend every waking moment dwelling in negativity?
     
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  15. Zaebore

    Zaebore Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2017
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    Takamoto Ayaka
    At this point after filtering and thinking very much, I believe this opportunity to make change will come around in success. The appearance of having a repeat episode of teaching Japanese comedy again is a sign of change and it is an experience that we will have to take as a journey with the girls as they continue their path as an idol. There is a difference however this time around as compared to when it was introduced late beforehand (the lessons were not being fully implemented) the girls this time have not as much exposure to variety and will build upon it. With this I believe this change will make great strides in a positive direction. If done correctly, we will have more content and any content with good measure and value is content that Keyaki will gain to help improve both growth and success. The witness of events that I have realized after thinking so far is that the lack of content for the Keyakizaka girls is prominent enough that I can recall little to none of any programs featuring the girls aside from their association of being performers and singers. I would like to see who they really are in the flesh aside from their characters in stage but it all begins with the house, their home, their variety program to see their values, characters, personality, but above all else who they are as an individual.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2019
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  16. dragonfrommars

    dragonfrommars Kenkyuusei

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    Mar 13, 2018
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    it's demanding too much to ask someone to put forth effort at their job? singing & dancing on stage is one aspect of their job, but they also get paid to do a variety show, so it only makes sense that we'd expect them to put forth effort right? also, i think you're looking at things only within the spectrum of extremes... "great in variety or great at performances"?

    nobody is asking them to be Sashi, but their not putting in any visible effort & thats the problem a lot of people seem to have. there's a large difference between Sashi & Takamina right? a large difference between Sayanee & Yamada Nana right? the formers were amazing at variety while the ladder were criticized for being unfunny, but theirs a difference from being unfunny & being bad at variety.

    the difference comes from effort. despite being unfunny or even introverted, you can be good at variety (as Takamina & Yamada were) if you put forth the effort, these 1st gen girls aren't putting forth any visible effort on the show (aside from a few) they just sit their & expect the MCs to do all the work, if i'm being honest here, thats what it looks like.

    and it's not that i dislike Keyaki, their my favorite idol group... but imo, me being a fan is wanting whats best for them not shielding them from the truth simply because you like them.

    i'm sure that the dude who said what he said only felt comfortable saying because he likes Keyaki, he simply just wants them to get better...which would make them more popular, what fan would be against that?
     
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  17. GenKelC

    GenKelC Kenkyuusei

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    I really dont care what anyone says, this girls are so perfect they way they are, they are the best Idol group ever, bigger than any other in Japan, and they make me feel so proud and Happy!!
     
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  18. rdamon42

    rdamon42 Kenkyuusei

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    Episode 201 was so intense. Say what you want about their variety skills, but Keya can really perform and deliver on the big stage.
     
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  19. Tenote

    Tenote Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2019
    I for sure don’t want to bring the drama back, but I think I should explain myself one more time.
    I just find it pointless to keep complaining about 1ki variety sense when they’re obviously not variety oriented. I’m pretty sure that they’re not going to magically change after all these years, so fans should just let it go imo.

    I think the reason why my opinion differs so much from yours is because I’m generally not an idol fan, at least not of mainstream ones. Idol fans definitely value variety more than I do.
     
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  20. EinhanderX

    EinhanderX Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    Another great episode. Thumbs up

    See girls? Just speak up, be yourself, and retort to Yoshimura the asshole-pretender. Anyone and him will make a great skit being frenemies. Habu good job, Runrun too. Pe and Karin is alright being silent as well. It's their chara. But anyone else doing it might have been edited out. Maybe it already cut out.

    Again girls, fight him back. Doesn't matter you're 1ki or 2ki. Fight for your screentime. Fight so you no longer the "sit tight and nice" type. Fight so you can be as natural on studio like it is in live concert. Fight so we know "Keyaki is fine being bad at variety and perfect the way they are now" is only a glass barrier, mere niceties to hold back your growth potential.

    Looking forward to next episode.
     
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