1. Results for our 11th Annual Stage48 Member Ranking are being revealed! Click here to see it and check how your oshimen did! Updated daily.

[GENERAL] The Keyakizaka46 Thread

Discussion in 'General Keyakizaka46 Discussion' started by ForrestFuller, Jun 28, 2015.

  1. Dill

    Dill Rank 81-100 (Temporary Name)

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2017
    Oshimen:
    Hirate Yurina
    Twitter:
    Dill46_48
    Please, let us know when you guys come back talking about Keyaki today and not some sort of unnecessary and unreal drama belonging to years ago. I'd be waiting for it.
    Time for Sakamichi shows. Much better than following bunshun
     
    • Like Like x 6
  2. kanjo

    kanjo Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2012
    Location:
    Ireland->Shimane
    Oshimen:
    Nishino Nanase
    1. No, this isn't "old". The source is from the time of posting here and the interviews are timed to this month. And even if it was, it doesn't matter. Is the Maho case any less important now than it was when it first became public? Regardless of what you think about the rumours, "old" is a terrible way to refute it. That stupid button needs to die.

    2. Bunshun isn't a bad source. It's a source we don't like because we don't want our idols stalked by paparazzi, but that doesn't mean they're unreliable. As much as we'd like to believe they're unreliable, they're not. They've done huge stories before, exposing real dirty shit on other parts of the entertainment industry. Like it or not, the general Japanese public cares about what Bunshun has to say. Not that they'll read every story, of course.

    That said, I don't just accept this story. I don't have an opinion. But I do believe it's worth following. Not because I believe Bunshun or because I expect that there is a bullying issue, but because I care about whether there is or not enough to take this seriously. People trying to say we shouldn't talk about this are enabling the same kind of issues in the NGT assault case to happen in Keyaki. Feel free to doubt it, but all the people saying it's impossible and shouldn't be discussed are risking letting a toxic environment exist in their favourite idol group, for whatever reason. And some of you are hypocrites who are fairly active on the NGT thread.
     
    • Winner Winner x 8
    • Agree Agree x 6
    • Like Like x 2
  3. EinhanderX

    EinhanderX Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2015
    As much as I don't want to discuss about it....
    Yeah, we as fans has responsibility to prevent that from ever happening.

    The article cite something about bully member having tendency to venerate on one member and they discouraged competition atmosphere. While I have a doubt it is true or comes due from fans influence, I think it is better to minimize that factor by moving toward another way (As fans, by encouraging individuality and competitive spirit on other members), hoping it can diminish the trigger for bullying environment to prosper or even exist by little....
     
  4. chrissirhc

    chrissirhc Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2016
    Oshimen:
    Yamaguchi Maho
    we should be careful about how we try to highjack the ngt case for our "causes" not gossiping isn't wasn't the cause of what happened there.
    we should also learn the meaning of the word hypocrite.
    spreading second\third hand rumors will never be a constructive way of tackling issues either
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. kanjo

    kanjo Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2012
    Location:
    Ireland->Shimane
    Oshimen:
    Nishino Nanase
    1) It didn't there. But protecting the group from investigation/being looked at risks letting similar things happen.
    2) Perhaps. If there's a more appropriate word for people who argue fervently for justice for Maho but don't want their favourite group and their favourite idols looked at for bullying, I'd love to know.
    3) Interviews with her brother and acquired LINE conversations aren't rumours. I'm not stating we should propagate Bunshun's conclusions as facts but I am saying we shouldn't ignore them just because we don't want them to be true.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2019 at 11:42 AM
  6. chrissirhc

    chrissirhc Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2016
    Oshimen:
    Yamaguchi Maho
    yes, the keya situation is a rumors. it's a rumor that's been denied by those actually involved. the difference between ngt and keya is the ngt scandal has a first hand source. there are things we know happened and haven't happened that can be discussed
    in a constructive manner.
    any discussion involving keya in this situation would be speculation that i can't see leading to anything constructive
     
  7. Rev4

    Rev4 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Oshimen:
    Watanabe Risa
    Regarded the old rumor Zuumin denied on her blog in feb 2018 and explained her job partner, Ishida-san, had enough.

    https://sakamichinokiseki.com/keyakizaka46/keyakizaka-142/

    He called Bunshun unprofessional with this article and should shut up. This news reached the big media instead of Bunshun's old story about Zuumin.

    But there will always be antis who will run with this in a month or so until it's forgotten and tiresome. Few fans right now use it for being sarcastic in comment section on twitter because it has created a meme.

    In the next Keyakake episode 1gen vs 2gen:
    "Don't teach 2gen about bullying"

    What these girls can do now is to prove for general public there is no bullying in the future with new Keyakizaka no matter if Bunshun tried to bring up a very old rumor that was only known in 2ch forum and Zuumin explained it on her blog which yahoo news and indoor news can't reach.

    Bunshun is a manipulated and greedy company so they should stick with photo evidence. Rumors is something you leave for arm chair analysts and is not official news. It doesn't lead to a constructive discussion which Bunshun should have known since they are journalists. It was embarrassing by Bunshun to write an article about a rumor when they should bring news as educated journalists.

    Those who didn't bought it were the rational thinkers and those who didn't questioning the article were emotional thinkers who is in-between if they should believe it or not. When you even got underground detectives that's how low the article was from Bunshun. Very unprofessional journalism like Ishida-san said.
     
  8. kanjo

    kanjo Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2012
    Location:
    Ireland->Shimane
    Oshimen:
    Nishino Nanase
    I'd be very happy to learn there's nothing behind this but I take issue with people saying "this shouldn't be given thought" because it's "old news". That's decidedly not "rational thinking". But a link to an archive of this blog would've been a great response and way to give confidence in the group. Does anyone happen to have one?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. miwa

    miwa Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2019
    I know the blog is from February of last year. I haven't found a translation of it but I think people have talked about it in Zuumin's thread.

    Supposedly there's an interview with Zuumin's brother in Bunshun's paid subscription service (I haven't heard anything about Line conversations though). However, I don't really know what the solution to this would be. I doubt Zuumin will say anything, whether this is true or not (she might not want to bring attention to it and her SNS in general is mainly used for selfies and promotional stuff, so unless she's asked about it in an interview then I don't think we'll hear from her). I don't know what Keyaki's management could do. They just posted a photo of two of the people that are rumored to be involved and the top reply is about Zuumin. It would be sad if this would follow Keyaki, especially because of the girls who are not involved (which is something you could apply to NGT as well). But of course it would be even worse if this is actually true and this is what caused Zuumin's graduation.
     
  10. Rev4

    Rev4 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Oshimen:
    Watanabe Risa
    Those few people being loud about it in comment section has moved their aim at culprits who are rumored to be involved. They went from the whole group to certain members.

    The group as a whole will be fine but who will get damage most by this rumor are the members who are rumored to be involved.

    This group sings about bullying (Getsuyoubi) and may have culprits in the group who could be considered as hypocrites by fans. It just so weird why they bring it up now and targeted it in the weekend. That's fishy to me when you have NGT scandal in full force. This is a rumor and could have been published in a normal work day.

    I think NGT managers muted Bunshun behind the scenes to make them distract from general public talk about the NGT scandal and let them focus on something else.

    But with rumors they always last 6 months at best in general public's memory until they forget about it when you have fresh news stealing the attention from it.
     
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. gish0046

    gish0046 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    Didn't they also have first hand accounts and LINE conversations "proving" that Kiichan hated Asuka and was talking shit about other members and dating a Johnnys boy? All of which turned out to be false and was just made up by Kiichan antis?

    That's the problem with Bunshun, they don't do any investigating on their own. All of their information comes from "contacts" who are often member antis, idol stalkers, or yakkai wota. And as we saw in the Maho case, these types of bad people will entrap the girls and then use the threat of sending compromising information to Bunshun to blackmail or coerce them. By supporting Bunshun you're supporting this type of corruption.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019 at 12:46 AM
    • Like Like x 5
    • Agree Agree x 2
  12. Xiphyas

    Xiphyas Upcoming Girls

    Joined:
    May 22, 2017
    Location:
    Japan
    Muu-chan and Satoshi-chan on Yuugata Paradise. Really funny and some hidden details.

     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019 at 3:55 AM
    • Like Like x 3
  13. amimaru

    amimaru Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Oshimen:
    Koike Minami
    somehow reminds me of ricky n morty "total rickall" episode
     
  14. Dill

    Dill Rank 81-100 (Temporary Name)

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2017
    Oshimen:
    Hirate Yurina
    Twitter:
    Dill46_48
    Were you replying to me? It seems so, but I see no name there so I don't want assume.

    Anyway, others have already answered and there's no much to say without being repetitive. It is old news and following NGT case gives you an idea on how much desperate is bunshun to turn the attention away from it. Keyaki is an easy target.
    Actually, just looking to Maho's assault thread should give people a clear view of how much unprofessional Bunshun is.
    But to each their opinion.

    Mine is that it would be quite absurd create drama where it doesn't exist following Bunshun lead like puppets and diverting our attention where it needs to be right now (and since awhile), on NGT.
    And if that make me an hypocrite (how?) so be it.
     
  15. kanjo

    kanjo Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2012
    Location:
    Ireland->Shimane
    Oshimen:
    Nishino Nanase
    @Dill no, wasn't you particularly.
    But this isn't the first time I've seen this said and I have not been following the details of the NGT case (the thread on stage doesn't exactly make it easy). Could you or anyone provide a summary of what the NGT case shows about Bunshun?
     
  16. gish0046

    gish0046 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    Regardless of the details of NGT's case, the way Bunshun gathers information is inherently harmful and exploitative to the point of even enabling coercive rape.
    By gathering information from stalkers and yakkai wota the following situation can easily happen to entrap idols.
    Yakkai #1 and Yakkai #2 see an idol out in public minding her business.
    Yakkai #1 goes up to idol and says he's her fan, he really likes her. Idol is nice and trusting and converses with him, etc. like a normal entertainer would when meeting a fan.
    Meanwhile Yakkai #2 is in the distance taking pictures.
    Yakkai #1 and Yakkai #2 confront idol. Yakkai #1 says "Be nice to us and do what we ask you to do or I'm going to tell Bunshun I'm your boyfriend and give them these pictures as proof."
    Idol is then given the choice of either giving these Yakkai what they want (e.g. sleeping with them) or having their career ruined by Bunshun.

    We know this kind of thing happens because one of the Yakkai wota who was part of the group who attacked Maho (but not one of the attackers) named Inapooh was a prolific idol stalker who was on Bunshun's payroll. Him and his group were treated like kings by management. Why? Because they had heavy dirt on several top NGT members and could use that information to blackmail management and members. He's also alleged to have raped an underage idol.

    A version of the above scenario was allegedly played out by Inapooh himself in Shida Manaka's case. He took a picture of her out with a male friend (maybe her boyfriend, maybe not, who cares). He then tried to use the photo to blackmail her. She didn't comply and so he sent the photo to Bunshun and said it was her with her boyfriend. Ruined her career. He was allegedly the one responsible for the Keyaki dorm break-in.

    Bunshun doesn't vet their sources. Not only do they not vet their sources, by having someone like Inapooh on their payroll, a well-known yakkai wota and idol stalker, they show that they are willing to actively support that kind of behavior.

    So moral of the story, whether Bunshun is factual or not, Bunshun should be ignored and dismissed as a matter of course due to the fact that the way they gather information enables abuse and harassment.

    Edit: You may have noticed a lot of what I wrote had the word "allegedly" in it. That's true however we know for a fact that Bunshun printed Kiichan's "scandal" which was proved to be false and part of harassment campaign by Kiichan antis. This led to her hiatus which hurt her career. This is an obvious and factual example of how Bunshun's lax and harmful information gathering practices enable targeted harassment.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019 at 10:22 AM
    • Informative Informative x 9
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
  17. kanjo

    kanjo Stage48 Moderator Staff Member Stage48 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2012
    Location:
    Ireland->Shimane
    Oshimen:
    Nishino Nanase
    Thank you for the detailed and careful response.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. gish0046

    gish0046 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2019
    Sorry to bring down the mood of the thread but its super important to me that everyone knows how terrible Bunshun is.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  19. Rev4

    Rev4 Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Oshimen:
    Watanabe Risa
    No, it's good you told the dark truth about Bunshun. I'm shocked they are still around when they cooperate with criminals and print "make up stories" articles. For every case they have committed a crime and are illegal as journalists. What is saving them from bankruptcy is the dirty underworld by yakuza.

    This is why I wonder if it's the antis who are very loud on social media and general public ignore Bunshun and do only follow NHK for factual news.

    Many fans have ignored Bunshun but there are extreme Zuumin fans and Shiichan antis and even Ue antis try to bring them down mentally in the comment section. Ue and Shiichan should just ignore them. What will happen to this rumor is to bring out the evidence as some fans want to let it die down for good and Bunshun can't bother Keyaki anymore or Sakamichi in general as they had a hiring spree of managers for Keyaki and Hinata who will start to work in April this year. Security will be much more protective than in the past.
     
  20. Tanoichan

    Tanoichan Kenkyuusei

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Oshimen:
    Takahashi Minami
    But this can't be ignore. Maybe it is false but if it is true, we can't accept it. That is the reason why we should keep aware of the situation even if we don't believe it/we don't want to believe it.
     
    • Dislike Dislike x 3
    • Agree Agree x 3

Share This Page