Yeah now presumably if there's less relevant news I'll probably summarize or roll-up the translations.
I don't know. I like that you keep all these small details pouring in and being chronicled here in this thread for posterity. What appears to be irrelevant today could turn out to be very telling and an important detail tomorrow. I'd say: "Keep them coming!"
For those that are interested then, I posted yesterday's summary in the General NGT thread. Until I figure out what to do, I'll try to keep posting the daily translations on my own site (but won't keep making announcements here). Here's today's though: https://saitowinterstar.com/ngt48-assault-case-summary-for-june-17-2019/
I mean... most of it hasn't been about the assault case for weeks. Still, they are handy to stay updated on what's happening with NGT members (even if it tends to be a bit skewed). Maybe make a dedicated thread for them?
@SaitoWinterStar Personally, I enjoyed your summaries, FWIW. So I am happy if you choose to continue doing them. Even if it doesn't relate to the original intention of the thread, I still found a lot of it informative. The NGT Thread is fine I think.
The problem is that a lot of people are using the general NGT thread as a safespace pretending that nothing is wrong with the group. The summaries are better here or in their own thread, in my opinion.
Or alternatively it's the thread for people who still care about the group and want to see it recover, rather than the destructive circlejerk only accepting of the most outlandish and negative hypotheticals that this thread has become. In that regard the general NGT news that makes up 90% of the summaries these days would be nice in that thread, but the conspiracy crap that makes up the other 10% belongs nowhere but here.
Or alternatively it's the thread for people who are blind to the truth and would rather everything go back to normal than ensure that the members they pretend to care about are safe and that management is held to a higher standard. See how easy that is to do? Opinions are opinions and you are entitled to yours, but it's pretty easy to argue that people who just want to move on from this issue care a lot less about the members than the people who are still critical and want to get to the bottom of the issues NGT is plague with.
Yep, those connected to the fans will still run amok behind the scenes and try to pull something similar again. Not like the reactions to the first incident was that serious. Those girls just got nothing else better to do and don't care about their careers, like if the group ends tomorrow then whatever ya know who cares.
I care if the group ends, but I'd much rather it was disbanded rather than just going back to business as usual. But, why are those our only two options?
Those are probably the only options left at the moment due to the handling of the situation up to now. They had the option of going all AKB 8th Gen on the group of allegedly "black" members but they didn't. They are left really with the options now of ending the group or trying to spin everything enough to fight their way through ... Trouble is at this point whilst they seem to be doing the latter the situation doesn't seem to be recoverable and it just seems an exercise by AKS management to try and save face. It is a shame for the members who were doing the right thing and have been affected by this and you do have to wonder when will be true point where it would be better for them to leave rather than go down with the group
Na, atm it's just beating a dead horse. In the end it worked out pretty nice for AKS. They managed to limit the outrage to one sister group. It was AKS who were responsible for the post-incident decision making. Yet people are still focusing their anger towards the entity of NGT and are not considering that the result would have likely been the same if a similar incident would have occurred in a different AKS managed group. I get, it's a convenient way of handling the situation, especially if you had no prior interest in NGT or only in the sacked trio. It makes it easier to justify supporting your non-NGT oshis. But in the end it only shows AKS that they can get away with their Modus Operandi as long as their favs remain part of their organization. So if the fandom allows the other groups to continue as if nothing happened, you may argue that it is only fair that NGT is allowed to do the same.
Is it time for that game again? 'Spot the difference: AKS Manager or wlerin!?' The difference may be smaller than you think!
That depends on whether you are on the "guilty until proven innocent" team or the "innocent until proven guilty" team
What's interesting about this to me is that in one of the latest AKBingo episodes, where Oya Shizuka, Kashiwagi Yuki, Asai Nanami, Oguri Yui and Yahagi Moeka were driving around and talking casually, they also said they should try and find a common goal again to push AKB forward, and also said "Let's go to Tokyo Dome again, it's been 5 years since the last concert." I've noted this before, but the old (original) AKB was about pushing the group forward and reaching a common goal, and that's why they seemed to have pretty good team work. It's inevitable for some girls not to get along, but if you have a common goal, you'll still pull yourself together and work with them to get where you want. Now, AKB is famous and when you're part of the group, your biggest goal will be to stand out. Everyone already knows AKB but as a member, you probably wanna be the next Acchan or Sasshi or Mayuyu. I'm not saying the old AKB was better than the current one, there's good and bad things about both sides*, but it could help them unit if they tried going for one goal together instead of pursuing individual goals. *Remember that article back in early May, where they noted how putting the group first often means that the idols have to suffer https://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/article?a=20190504-00011819-bunshun-ent&p=1 Are you saying the 8th Gen was removed because the girls were no good, personality-wise? I thought they simply weren't good enough and didn't pass the Kenkyuusei Evaluations
From what has been said on here in the past a major contributing factor was them acting in a manner which was not compatible with being a member of the group
In fact, the evaluation ran at the time, was the official excuse to remove those girls, they were bound to fail whatever their quality was even before it started. The unofficial reason was their very poor work ethic and behaviors.
It wasn't unofficial (although I think not stated at the time) togasaki said it quite clearly in an interview/book where he discussed a little about each generation up until the current at the time of the interview. They were worried the problems of the 8th gen would spread to the 9th so removed them all.
Addendum: I'd rather post it here than dump it on Twitter (strangely enough it wasn't granted much relevance in those news updates in the previous days, but since it seems to be all an one-man work who can complain), but anyway the other day there has been a lecture/debate held at the Hosei University themed around the case, with the participation of some pretty prominent figures who more or less played a role in covering it in the past. I was looking around for reports on it expecting to find a recap of only known information, but point ③ caught my attention (I'm adding the rest too for completion, though). I guess it pretty much confirms it that Maho was understandably unwilling to go back to the apartment or Niigata anymore afterward, and that most importantly by around the middle of December the press was already half aware of the assault (and not the watered-down explanation by the management, for that matter). Why is it that these details only pop up through off-the-record talk baffles me, considering how easy they are to fall through the cracks. --- 法政大学の工事中の通路を抜けて新しい校舎の４階Y404教室で開催。午後一時から午後五時過ぎまで休憩を挟みながら質問タイムも交えつつの講座でした。内容は殆どがNGTの事件山口真帆さん関連で、後半からは矢作ちゃんのスキャンダルにも触れるなど、昨今のアイドル業界全般についての話もありました https://twitter.com/KAITEnobu1/status/1142444118833950722 That was held at classroom Y404 on floor 4 of the new school complex of Hosei University, just out of the passageway currently under restructuring. It was a lecture held from 1PM to late 5PM, with a pause in between, also including a question time corner here and there. The content concerned almost completely Yamaguchi Maho-san, from the NGT incident, but with also a mention made about Yahagi-chan's scandal in the latter half -- so there was some talk about the idol industry as a whole in these current times. --- 司会は稲増龍夫教授で、中森先生、小松記者、そして新潟日報モア編集長の星さんが登場しました。 https://twitter.com/KAITEnobu1/status/1142465879067639808 Presiding over the lecture was professor Inamasu Tatsuo. Mister Nakamori, journalist Komatsu, and Hoshi-san, the editor in chief of Niigata Nippo More were also there to attend it. [Side note: Nakamori is Nakamori Akio, pop culture critic who also wrote a whole page on Maho's case in the past, for which Maho showed gratitude to him on DM Komatsu is Komatsu Ryujiro, working at Asahi Shinbun and often doing coverage on all matters regarding the 48 family Hoshi's full name is Hoshi Tatsuo, who in the past also did interviews and coverage for NGT48, also his kami-oshi is Riko] --- ①小松記者が長野支社時代に近藤さんや西村さん等の長野に関わりのあるメンバーを筆頭に社会的側面から48を取材してきた歴史を紹介。その後、2019/1/8の事件発覚から2019/1/14日の成人式取材までを時系列順に朝日社内の動きを解説しながらまるでリアルタイムのように解説してくれました。 https://twitter.com/KAITEnobu1/status/1142626112188477440 ① Journalist Komatsu first introduced his history of providing coverage of the 48 groups from the societal aspect of it, starting with Kondo [Moeri], Nishimura [Nanako] and all other members related to Nagano, during his days at the branch office over there. Afterwards, he gave an exposition of the actions taken inside of Asahi, from the incident coming to light in 2019/1/8 until the interview at the Coming of Age Day in 2019/1/14, set in chronological order, explaining it as if it happened in real time. -- ②朝日新聞アイドル取材班を挙げて、有志の記者が一貫して事件を追っていく模様を述懐。事件発覚から今日まで一貫して社会的事件として報道している事がわかりました。 https://twitter.com/KAITEnobu1/status/1142641753637261312 ② Mentioning Asahi Shinbun's idol reporter department, he recalled about the way the volunteering journalist pursued the case consistently. One thing I have understood is that from the discovery of the incident until today it was uniformly reported as a case of social concern. --- ③2018/12/18くらいに、山口真帆さんがストーカー被害？に遭って実家に帰省していることが小松さんの耳に入ってきたと。その後ネットの情報でSRでの告発を知り、「刑事事件」「メンバー関与」を訴えている内容にとんでもない事だと衝撃を受けたみたいです。 https://twitter.com/KAITEnobu1/status/1142647417751261185 ③ Also, turns out that around 2018/12/18, it first came to Koumatsu-san's attention that Maho Yamaguchi-san had been the victim of what was stalking (?) and by that time had returned back to her family's home. Later on he came to know about the disclosure on Showroom through informations on the Internet, and in front of the details denouncing it as a "criminal case" with "members' involvement", it seems he was shocked to realize what a tremendous matter it actually was. --- ④朝日新聞の社会部のフットワークの軽さが印象に残りました。現役の記者さんのお話はとても勉強になりました。 https://twitter.com/KAITEnobu1/status/1142728400299163648 ④ What left a lasting impression to me was the prompt action on part of Asahi Shinbun's social affairs division. The talk from a journalist currently employed there was very enlightening to me. --- http://www.jikenjiko-hukabori.com/article/467421432.html Doing this more for a personal note, but for a more detailed rundown of the lecture here's a translation too. Once again the fact the first ever mention of it came out during a LINE chat with a fan really makes you think...: Spoiler: Translation 冒頭 Opening ・自己紹介(小松記者がアイドルを好きになった経緯、NGTを取材するきっかけについて) ・Self introduction (journalist Komatsu talked about the process through which he became fond of idols, and what prompted him to cover NGT) 小松記者談：事件前後の話 Lecture by journalist Komatsu: story before and after the incident ・事件当日)は知らなかったが12/18にファンとのLINEで、山口真帆が悪質なストーカーに追われている、実家に帰ったという情報をもらう ・Although he didn't know about it on the very day of the incident, during a LINE chat with a fan on December 18 he received the information that Yamaguchi Maho was victim of some malicious-minded stalkers and had since returned back to her family's home ・1/9朝に山口真帆のTwitterの内容を確認し、アカンことが起きていると理解した(メンバーが関与した刑事事件であるとの発言) ・It is only when he checked the details of Yamaguchi Maho's Twitter on the morning of January 9 that he realized something unspeakable had happened (case in point, the mention of it being a criminal case in which members were implicated) ・SHOWROOM告発前後すぐにリアルタイムで情報の収集(AKSは音信不通) ・Right around the time of the Showroom disclosure they immediately went to collect informations in real time (considering AKS made themselves unreachable) ・3周年記念公演時山口真帆の謝罪によりお怒り心頭。社会部で記事を取り扱うことになった ・Yamaguchi Maho's apology at the Third Anniversary theater show only resulted in fierce indigation. It is then that the social affairs division started to handle articles about the case. ・社会部内LINEである意見が出た(以下意見) 【NGT運営は、運営側が事件のことを謝罪するよりも、山口本人が謝罪することでファンが「そんなことないよー！」とよくあるパターンで、やっすい演出で丸く収めようとしたのではないか】 ・There was a certain opinion (shown below) that then popped up right on the LINE group chat of the social affairs division «Wanna bet that the management was attempting to wrap up the case with this cheap show appearance because, as it's a frequent pattern, the fans would react "Don't say such a thing~!" more easily before an apology by Yamaguchi herself, than it would be with the management side apologizing over the incident instead?» --- 運営の対応 On the management response ・今村支配人が全く出てこないため説明が難しい ・With theater manager Imamura failing to show up at all, an explanation for it is difficult ・成人式の取材については本来は新潟で行うべきものである ・About that conference at the Coming of Age Ceremony, that's something they should have done in Niigata as a matter of principle ・第三者委員会の運営の対応で、AKS・NGTへの信頼は地に落ちた ・With the management's response about the third-party commitee, the trust about AKS and NGT has hit its lowest ・AKSの杜撰さや説明責任を果たさなかったことで、インターネット上には真相か嘘なのか分からない情報にまみれてしまった(いなぷぅさレモン、菅野の名前が上がり会場に笑いが起きる) ・Thanks to AKS's sloppiness and their failure to hold themselves accountable, the Internet became ridden with informations one can't tell if it's true or false (also, laughs came up in the hall when the names of Inapooh and Sugano [player of the Giants, one hypotesis was that he got his private informations sold by Inapooh] were brought up) ・本当はこういう状態は良くないが、第三者委員会本人が調査結果を発表しなかったために今の状態になっている ・To be honest, this situation is no good, but it turned like this now thanks to the fact that the members of the third-party commitee weren't there to personally announce the results of their own research 山口真帆について On Yamaguchi Maho ・最後の最後までアイドルを貫く姿勢、NGTに残った大切なメンバーを守った ・Until the very last moment she stayed true to the notion of idol with her stance, she protected those members she cherished for and who remained inside of NGT --- 新潟の特殊性 On the peculiarities of Niigata ・運営の脆弱性はあり、他の支店に比べて緩い対応(ex.HKTの大量解雇) ・The management has its own vulnerabilities, compared to other branch groups their response is looser (take for examples, HKT's mass dismissals) ・日本海側で初めてのAKBグループ支店、Negiccoというご当地アイドルの存在がある中で成功することは大きなポイントであった(成功すれば、同じように地方でもできると考えられたため) ・By being the first AKB branch group on the coast of the Sea of Japan, a big focal point was to achieve success while a local idol group, Negicco, was already present over there (since it was believed that if only they managed to succeed, the same would have been possible in other such regional areas) ・新潟側の協力なバックアップは他の支店と比べてこれほどまでなかった ・The backup, in terms of cooperation, from the Niigata side wasn't ever that big in comparison to other branch groups ・NGTは今新潟の問題となり、地元で愛されイメージアップのはずが全く逆になってしまった ・Right now NGT has become an issue for Niigata, it was supposed to boost the image and be loved by the region, but it turned out in the total opposite direction 新潟の現状(取材に来ていた新潟日報の星さんより説明) On the current situation in Niigata (explanation by Niigata Nippo's Hoshi-san, who went to perform a report on it) ・事件前は県全体でも応援していた ・Prior to the incident it used to be supported by the whole prefecture ・事件後、NGTが表面上から消えた ・After the incident, NGT basically fell off the face of earth ・万代にあるNGTのポスターには、荻野由佳の顔に落書きが頻繁にされ、何度も貼り直している ・On the NGT posters in Bandai city, Ogino Yuka's face is frequently being scribbled on, so they have to replace them several times ・もはや恥さらしの状態 ・The situation is that they are pretty much seen as a black mark ・メンバー叩きの風潮に心を痛めてしまっている ・His heart breaks at this tendency to bash members ・一般人によるNGTの見え方は「メンバーが山口をいじめて消すために男たちを使った」になっており、なかなかその世論が尾を引いている ・The way of seeing NGT, from ordinary people, has turned into "There's other members who took advantage of those men to harrass Yamaguchi and make her go", this public opinion is having a lasting effect on it ・NGTの復活は現状難しいと思うが、一所懸命頑張っているメンバーがなんとか立てる場を持たせたい ・He finds that the recovery of NGT is hard in the current state, but he would like to let those members who are applying themselves have a place where to stand on --- Q&Aコーナー Q&A corner NGTに関わりそうな質問のみ抜粋(気になるものがあれば、回答を個別で載せれる範囲で載せます) Only citing the questions that are related to NGT or seem so (if there's something you are interested in, I'll post the answers separately as far as I can) 1.不起訴となっているため、刑事事件といっていいのか？ 1. Since it ended up without prosecution, is it safe to call it a criminal case? 2.事件後に「新潟にふるさと納税をしない」といったような言葉は脅迫では？なぜマスコミは報道しないのか？県や市の対応はおかしいのでは？ 2. After the incident, don't "I'll refuse to pay the Hometown Tax to Niigata" and other such statements count as threats? How come mass media isn't reporting on it? Isn't the response by the Prefecture and the City weird? 3.AKSが何か隠そうとしているように感じるが何か当たりはついているか？ 3. It feels like that AKS has something they are trying to keep hidden, but didn't you come across something so far? A(星)→ない。決定的な証拠がないため書きようがない。八方塞がりの状態。 Answer (Hoshi): Nope. There's no definitive clues so far, so we are in no condition to write anything. We are finding closed doors everywhere. A(小松)→本人・当事者じゃないと分からない状況。 Answer (Komatsu): This is a situation where noone but the people personally involved know the facts. A(中森)→はっきりしないと色々分からない。AKSは悪いのもあるが何よりもひたすらいい加減である(戸賀崎のTwitterの件など)。悪ければHKTのように解雇できた。NGTも当初山口が言っていたように悪い奴をやめさせて再生すればよかったはず。 Answer (Nakamori): We can't hope to understand it unless they make things clear. AKS has also something vicious about it, but above anything else there's the fact they are careless (see the case of Togasaki's Twitter, just to name one). If they were just vicious they would have fired people like HKT did. Even for NGT, it would have been more preferable if they had sacked the wrongdoers, as Yamaguchi described in the beginning, and then they had started over. ところが、加藤のインスタ誤爆騒動や早川の意味不明なTwitterでさらに訳が分からなくなる。 Besides, between the commotion surrounding Kato's Instagram misposting, and the incomprehensible tweets by Hayakawa, things make even less sense now とにかくAKSがいい加減すぎて、誰が悪い奴なのか分からないため、バッサリ悪を切ることができない。 Bottom line is that AKS is too sloppy for its own good, you can't even tell who are the evildoers inside, so getting rid of the bad apples is impossible to do. 4.今後山口真帆への取材への申し込みは？ 4. Any request for an interview with Yamaguchi Maho in the next future? 5.第三者委員会での山口の感じ方は？ 5. What was your perception of Yamaguchi with the third-party committee? 6.今後アイドルを目指す人たちにとっては影響があるのでは？また、私たち(山口真帆と同じくらい)の年代の女子には最大のニュースバリューであるだが、風化しつつあるのでは？ 6. Do you thing this will have an impact on those girls aspiring to be idols from here on? For the girls of our age (about the same as Yamaguchi Maho), this holds the greatest news value, but isn't there risk this is fading away? 7.今後の動くとしたら臨時訴訟か？ 7. Supposing there'll be any future actions, will there be a provisional lawsuit? 8.握手会のまとめ出しのようなシステムは、繋がり強要などの問題になるのではないか？ 8. Is the "matomedashi" system at handshake events really turning into a problem, as in the matter of (fans) demanding for private consorting?
